Hello Roger,



You posted the following:



R:>>I'm not trying to gang up on you, but I tend to side with Justin and Bob on this... some thoughts...>>



DW: I don?t feel ganged up on at all; I am truly enjoying our respectful dialogue/s. So, please feel free to take me to task as often as you wish/can.



R:>>I keep attempting to point out that, at least from my perspective, it appears that in the final analysis this entire discussion centers around one's definition of words like: "glory," "santification," "incorruptable" and even "divine.">>



DW: Agreed.



R:>>To me, the attributes that make God God, are not replicable or transferable... namely: omniscience, omnipotence and eternal past, present and future. There is a difference, in my view, between the relationship of {God the Son & God the Father} and {God the Trinity and human beings.} >>



DW: First, the attributes you listed which ?make God God? are, IMO, not the only ones which ?make God God?. Second, I want to make it clear that I too believe in a difference between the relationship that God the Father has with God the Son, and that with His adopted Sons?God the Son is God by nature, while the adopted Sons are God by grace. (This difference cannot be minimalized; indeed, in must be stressed.)



R:>>You and I and Justin and Bob can all agree, I presume, that Jesus Christ is an uncreated being--a being who has always existed and therefore, presumably has always been co-equal with God, hence, John's conclusion: and the Word was God.>>



DW: Yes, we all agree on this. However, non-Trinitarians have, and do, adamantly disagree with us on this.



T:>>There is no clearer statement of Christ's absolute equal share (for lack of a better word) of complete Godhood than the "I AM" statement he makes to the Pharisees in Matthew (I believe) in which Jesus claimed not only to be one with God but to actually be God. This was all they needed to pick up stones and start throwing.>>



DW: Though I personally believe that Jesus Christ was/is fully God, I do not believe that any one Biblical text, in and of itself, clearly teaches this.



R:>>I believe this is significant to this discussion in that no matter what state of "glory" we may or may not achieve, and however we choose to define the relevant words, we can never lay claim to such equality with God. This is a key distinction and, in my view, should be considered when attempting to determine Biblical teaching on the deification or lack thereof of created human beings.



Where am I wrong?>>



DW: With all due respect, I would say that you are allowing certain presuppositions to overly influence your reading of the texts themselves. I would also say that you need to understand much of your argument/s and presuppositions against the full deification of God the Father?s adopted Sons is very similar to the argument/s and presuppositions used by non-Trinitarians against the full deity of God the Son.



But then, I could be all wet!!! :~) :~) :~)



Grace and peace,



David